Thursday, July 27, 2006

Western Guy - Where’s that Damn Negative Now?

There’s nothing that bothers me more than people talking out of their asses and dismissing another person’s opinions as rubbish, without researching the same themselves. Over at Secret Arabian, I’ve been following a rather interesting debate.

What caught my eye in this initially was someone’s blatant denial that Jews run American Politics & Media. This is old news to most of us, who have bothered with our research, but some can’t grasp the idea that it’s true.

Feeling a little better today, I decided to do the research for Western Guy. I’m almost 100% sure that even with this evidence, he’ll deny the facts and still tell us we believe in rubbish, simply because selective hearing & understanding is the norm among these types; either this or he’ll suddenly go quiet. Western Guy, can you admit you’re wrong? Can you? Whether or not Western guy accepts it, it’s now all here, so the rest of you in denial about how much control the Jews actually have in America can shut the fuck up. Here is your evidence.

Bush's Daddy Comments on Iraqi Invasion:

CNN on Bush’s Daddy Comments

All Google Results because a lot of the pages I’m unable to open due to Etisalat’s proxy.

American Jewish Government:

Jews in Parliament? Says Bush himself, ’ For a hundred years, American Presidents have benefited from the good advice of the American Jewish Committee, and I am one. (Applause.) You have had a profound impact on American political life because you have worked tirelessly for noble goals.’ - President Bush in a speech at American Jewish Committee's Centennial Dinner.

Wikipedia on American Jewish Congress

And finally, Jews in America:

Now look at this: Russ Feingold and Herbert Kohl are the two Jewish senators from Wisconsin, where Jews constitute 0.5% of the population. We all know Joseph Lieberman, erstwhile vice-presidential candidate, is U.S. senator from Connecticut. But did you know that Carl Levin is senator from Michigan, which has only 107,000 Jews, constituting 1.1 % of that state’s population? Pennsylvania has elected the Republican Arlen Specter to the senate several times. He is the only Jewish Republican in the senate and comes from a state whose Jewish population is only 2.4%. Paul Wellstone of Minnesota is one of 42,000 Jews in a state with a population of 4,776,000 so that Jews are only 0.9% of Minnesotans and finally Ron Wyden, the Jewish senator from Oregon, represents 3,316,000 Oregonians of whom 0.9% or 30,500 are Jews.

Ten of the 100 U.S. Senators are Jewish. We are five times over-represented in the U.S. Senate because the non-Jewish population votes for Jews not because the candidates are Jewish but because the American population is generally not bigoted.

Likewise, there are 27 Jews in the House of Representatives, constituting 6.5% of the membership. Again we are 3 times overrepresented because religion is not a factor in American politics.

Right now, seven Jews are running for governor in this fall’s elections. In earlier years, Jews have been governors in Alaska, Idaho and Utah as well as in New York. There are of course also numerous Jews in state legislatures and in other political offices.’

Jewish Media:

A long ‘partial’ list of Jews in some of the biggest News resources including;

“ARIE FLEISCHER, Dubya's press secretary.

STEPHEN EMERSON, every media outlet's first choice as an expert on domestic terrorism.”

Another Partial List including;

’ DONALD NEWHOUSE, chairman of the board of directors, Associated Press.’

I am right. You are wrong. Deny it all you will - just do it someplace else, kay?


Blogger Brn said...


I do not know any sensible person who would disagree that Jews are over-represented in the media and politics (also in law and medicine) in the US. BUT, that does not equal control of those things, which is what you are asserting is true.

You may be right in your conclusion (I don't think so, but it is possible). However, your evidence doesn't prove what you are asserting.

1:33 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger Tainted Female said...

I appreciate your thoughts, but I disagree with you wholeheartedly for the following reasons:

Bush himself said, ‘You have had a profound impact on American political life (…)’

The word profound means:

1. Situated at, extending to, or coming from a great depth; deep.
2. Coming as if from the depths of one's being: profound contempt.
3. Thoroughgoing; far-reaching: profound social changes.
4. Penetrating beyond what is superficial or obvious: a profound insight.
5. Unqualified; absolute: a profound silence.

And in the Media (if you clicked on some of those links) you’ll see that the Presidents of some of the most prominent media outlets in America are Jewish. Who has more control in any establishment than a president?

1:40 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger adevents said...

that does not equal control of those things
Come on be reasonable here!

2:08 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger adevents said...

the above comment is for BRN

2:10 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger Brn said...


First, surely you are not relying on President Bush to speak with exact precision.

Second, whenever someone addresses a group meeting like that, you know that they butter them up.

I did look at your lists, and a) a lot of it is out of date or inaccurate (for example, Ari Fleisher has not been press secretary for some time) and b) not all of those positions have any real power (two quick examples, the press secretary has no control over the media or government at all, and Michael Savage is a minor talk radio host who got fired from the only major media job he had after two weeks, hardly proof of Jewish hegemony).

2:21 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger Brn said...


Respectfully, I don't see how you can assert that disproportionate representation means control.

Let me give you a counter example. African-Americans make up more of the US Army than they in the general population. Does that mean that they run the army? Or does it just mean that they have taken advantage of an opportunity.

2:26 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger Destitute Rebel said...

Interesting post, Even though I try to stay away from religious topics After the whole UN observers bombing deal. I intend to do a detailed post today on how and why the Israelis get away with almost anything.

3:14 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger Brn said...


Those are good points that you bring up. However, while the US does frequently support Israel, I do not think that the US does support *everything* that Israel does. For example, My recollection is that the US had to strongly "encourage" the Israelis to negotiate in Oslo at the end of the first Gulf War.

I think that you are confusing cause and affect. Most Americans that I know support Israel not because it is a Jewish state, but because it is a democracy.

I think that the reason that the US government has taken the position that Israelis WMD are not a problem and Iran's or Iraq's are is that they do not believe that the Israelis would launch an unprovoked attack with them, but that we do not believe the same thing of Iran or Iraq. Now, it may be that that belief is wrong, but since the Iranian president frequently makes threatening comments implying their use and Saddam actually used them against the Kurds, I don't think that you can fairly call that belief irrational. In general, the US has not wanted WMDs to proliferate, but has not complained overly much if a democracy has claimed that it needs them for self-defense (see India, for example).

3:31 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger Brn said...


This is a very interesting discussion, thank you so much for making my boring day pass a little more happily.

I think that we may be disagreeing about what we mean by "control". I don't know what you all mean by "control" of the media. Do you mean that those in control can run any sort of biased stories that they want?

Also, if you say that "Jews control the media" this would seem to imply some sort of co-ordination towards a goal, otherwise it is meaningless. For example, if I said "people control the media" then that is undeniably true, but a pretty meaningless statement.

If you just stated "people biased towards Israel control the media" I would think that you are right, but then since most Americans are similarly biased, I would think that it would almost inevitably be true as well.

Thanks again for putting up with me.

3:37 PM, July 27, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thank God for brn and some semblance of intelligent analysis!

Given the argument that Jews control the US Government it would, of course, be instructive to examine how many Jewish Presidents there have been. I mean you don't get much more in control than that position, do you?

The answer is of course - none. Good grief, JFK had an uphill struggle because he was Catholic! From memory, same situation with Vice Presidents.

So, no Jews in the top two jobs - but they control the US Government. Yeah, right.

And how could we overlook the major Cabinet posts - Condoleeza Rice, Colin Powell before her, Rumsfeld (German heritage, no less) Gonzales (nice Jewish name) in Justice, Chao in Labor, Jackson (a black guy) at HUD, Gutierrez in Commerce etc etc.

The media - well, of course, that well-known African-American Richard Parsons, head of Time Warner must be Jewish I guess. As is the case with Rupert Murdoch who, I thought was from an establishment Australian family but obviously I got that wrong. That takes care of the two biggest media companies in the world then of course we have the chairman of General Electric, (the owners of NBC and Universal Studios) and the well known Japanese Jews who control Sony (and have a Welshman, Howard Stringer running it). Closely following there is the Chandler family of the LA Times and William Randolph Hearst and his descendants - I don't know, are they Jews too?

The list goes on and on and on. The truth of the matter is that the media and politics in America have been dominated for generations by WASP (if you'll forgive that term) males. But we don't hear everybody screaming about that do we?

The very fact that on some statistical analysis Jewish people seem to be over-represented is in fact an indication of how America works - it is a meritocracy, by and large. People rise to the top, or get elected to it, because - rightly or wrongly - people think they are the best person for the job.

That's one of the strengths of America. When JFK was running he went to a meeting of Protestant pastors and told them - I'm not running as a Catholic Presidential candidate, I'm running as the Democratic Presidential candidate. And of course we all know the American people accepted that, whatever reservations they had at the time about Catholics.

Jewish people, incidentally, are also vastly over-represented in the field of high end physics. I suppose this is terrible too. Naturally the reasons for all of this might be that a group of people who have ben subjected to racism and prejudice for centuries may have found it necessary to try even harder to find some form of success and acceptance.

I am not American and I am not Jewish. Personally I loathe what the Israelis are doing - and have been doing - since the establishment of their state.

There can be no peace until there is justice for the Palestinians - this is glaringly obvious to just about everyone except George Bush and Tony Blair. Neither of whom, of course, are Jewish but that doesn't mean they're not stupid

Nevertheless, the cause of peace and justive for the Palestinians is hardly furthered by repeating the same old canards about Jewish people in America. The facts just don't bear it out. Furthermore, as brn so rightly said - representation sure doesn't mean control. Statistically children are also over-represented in many families - that sure doesn't mean they control those families.

When you look at politics and media in the US - blame the WASP's if you have to find someone, I suppose

Certainly the Jews have a very strong and effective lobby.

And equally certainly some other countries, groups and causes might do well to learn from that success.


3:39 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger black feline said...

i don't know about 'CONTROL"..but the jewish community is definitely influential in US...remember George Soros?

6:12 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger Brn said...


I agree, they are very influential, especially compared to their relatively small percentage of the population. I think that the influence comes from their relatively high educational level (Jews as a group are much more educated than the American population) and wealth (again, they are wealthier than the average American - and obviously the two are related).

6:22 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger psamtani said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

8:19 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger phaedrus said...

over-represented or not, there are certain groups which are "in" and certain groups which are "out". right now,jews are definately "in". Jews are the cool blonde chearleader in your homeroom class. america wants to be bff. america wants to braid their hair at a sleep over and talk about boys and paint each other's toe nails. maybe i'm taking the metaphore too far, but that's just the way it is.

10:54 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger psamtani said...

Watch this

11:02 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger Brn said...


Thanks for the link to that video. It was a very effective piece of propaganda (please note: I do not mean that as a negative, only that it was one-sided).

I think one thing that I absolutely agree with the presenters of the video is that the media and specifically the American media, do a horrible job of presenting context for events, not just in the Palestinian-Israeli conflict. I saw a study just the other day (I can't find it right now, but I'll see if I can link to it later) that reported that any report on the conflict that tries to be objective is viewed by partisans on both sides as biased in favor of the other side, because of the lack of context.

11:22 PM, July 27, 2006  
Blogger Extinct Dodo said...

darn it, psamtani beat me to it :(

2:22 AM, July 28, 2006  
Blogger psamtani said...

I agree that it is one-sided, but its meant to be the 'other side' of the mainstream view.

Talking about control and representation though, Jews are "overrepresented" in most 'good' occupations - media, medicine, politics and academia. This however, is not the result of a conspiracy, but a testament to their determination and a natural result of their emphasis on education. As much as I am against Israel right now, I still admire what the Jewish American diaspora and the Israelites have been able to achieve.

Denying the Jewish influence on media though is ridiculous - not only do the Jews control it now, they were the pioneers of mass media. David Sarnoff created the first radio network - RCA. William Paley built CBS from a tiny network into the powerhouse it is today by coming up with the now ubiquitous advertisement-based business model. There's no denying the influence.

And, its only natural that those in control paint a pretty picture of their own community to the outside world - Arab-Americans would do the same if they were in power.

However, with regard to politics - most Jews are liberals and vote Democrat. As tantalize correctly pointed out, the biggest backers of the Republican party are conservative Christians. I think its incorrect to claim that they run politics, but in a democracy, those who control the people control the policy. And in today's America, media controls the people.

2:59 AM, July 28, 2006  
Blogger Brn said...


I agree completely with your point about how Jews have gotten into the positions they are in through hard work and education.

However, I think that you are way oversimplifying things when you say that the media "control" the American people. Polls consistently show that reporters and the media are one of the least trusted professions, so their influence over the American people is not exactly complete.

7:41 AM, July 28, 2006  
Blogger psamtani said...

@brn: so there's two separate questions here:

- Do Jews have a significant influence on the media?
- Can media be used to control the population?

The second one is the one we're dealing with now. The control is by no means absolute, but if all the information you recieve shows a single side, you will be inclined to believe that side. The more educated you are, and the more capable you are of doing your own research, the less control the media exerts over you.

In any case, the control does not have to be absolute to be effective - getting the majority to agree with you is good enough.

8:15 AM, July 28, 2006  
Blogger psamtani said...

@westernguy: Thats the worst argument you can come up with - its got nothing to do with the discussion we're having. Its for people like you that this database of arguments exists. Read through it, come back when youre better equipped.

On those issues where you cannot make a direct impact, all you can do is educate the public on your side of the argument.

7:53 PM, July 28, 2006  
Blogger psamtani said...

btw, Im opposed to the view that this is some kind of Jew-doo conspiracy (taking over the media). As mentioned earlier, the Jews have always been in control of the media, because they essentially 'invented' mass media in the states.

Paul Johnson mentions this in A History of the Jews:
The Broadway musical, radio and TV were all examples of a fundamental principle in Jewish diaspora history: Jews opening up a completely new field in business and culture, a tabula rasa on which to set their mark, before other interests had a chance to take possession, erect guild or professional fortifications and deny them entry.

As TF pointed out, its a natural bias to present media that shows your own people in a good light. Add to that the sensitivity that arises from centuries of persecution, and its perfectly clear to see why they'd be reluctant to show anything that could compromise their community.

And who can argue the education levels and standards of the American public?

Honestly, the Arab media is far worse and the Arab population is far LESS capable of doing their own research. I never even had a position on the Israel-Palestine conflict when I lived in Dubai because I knew that the information I got from the news and textbooks was absolute bullshit.

Americans are ignorant of world affairs because most large nations are inherently ethnocentric. Watch the news in India and you'll get it.

8:18 PM, July 28, 2006  
Blogger Brn said...


This is going to be my last response on this becaue I think that we have pretty much covered everything that there is to cover. I have really enjoyed seeing all the different viewpoints and have learned a lot.

I think that you have to understand that the American media is lazy (it is well know that many reporters just repeat whatever talking points they are given and do no research) and very ignorant (about history, economics, etc). For example, check out the first paragraph of
this story
. So it is not this story that they do not handle well. I do not ever recall hearing a story about a subject that I personally knew well that wasn't botched.

Let me just say in parting, however, that I do think that the situation is gradually changing. I have seen many more voices from the Palestinian side the last few years than I ever heard before. This isn't a promise that Americans will begin to side with the Palestinians. But if the terrorist attacks against Israeli civilians would stop, it would be much easier for Americans to view the Palestinians as the victims and not the aggressors.

8:50 PM, July 28, 2006  
Blogger Tainted Female said...

Western Guy…

This is now the second or third time you’ve mentioned ‘my own country’. Tell me what the fuck that relevance is? My country is Canada. I’m 100% Canadian, possibly a few French ancestors but they’re too far back for me to know about. That makes me a Western girl.

My ex husband is UAE national. My son is half-half. That gives me ties to the UAE. Some might even argue that it makes the UAE my country since I will be spending the rest of my life here.

So what the FUCK is your point? And obviously, you’re new to my blog. Fuck is my favorite word and not something I’ve added for the sake of your pixels – I usually tend to respect language while commenting in other people’s blogs. Forgive me for not forewarning you.

For your information I don’t believe in Democracy. A democracy is what voted in the likes of Bush – that should be proof enough that it doesn’t work. And if you look back a little in this blog, you’ll also see that Democracy allows pedophiles to enter politics. Democracy is like ‘freedom-of-speech’ neither exists in reality and both of them are overrated.

Sad really; the likes of you. You’re so very arrogant.

Psamtani, sometimes… you’re not so bad.

Brn.. It’s been a pleasure to have you here. And like you, I hope it all calms down soon enough.

9:37 PM, July 29, 2006  
Blogger Tainted Female said...

Sorry it took so long for me to reply... it seems I've been out of it for the last few days (and still am really)...

For the most part you've made valid arguments - or rather given valid information and if you'd been able to comment a few comments earlier (for some reason blogger was playing with my blog it seems because I couldn't comment either), I wouldn't have already replied to these things...

It's not necessarily a conspiracy I'm looking for... but you said yourself,

"After World War II, Zionists around the world begain using the holocaust as a pressure point in their demand for their own state. In doing this, they used a lot of the lessons learnt from the Nazi propoganda machine. Starting with claims that Palestine was uninhabited and then later with other moves, such as the conscious substitution of the word 'terrorist' for 'arab/palestinian' in their speeches and press. They also made a very strong (and succesful) effort to push the idea that 'anyone who doesn't support Israel is an anti-semite' into international consciousness."

If you scroll up, you'll see what I had to say about brainwashing Christians and using their support...



4:42 AM, July 31, 2006  

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