Wednesday, January 03, 2007

Blinded by Simultaneous Love & Hate – Saddam’s Execution & Response

Like most bloggers who have been silent, I assume, I’ve had some very conflicting feelings and thoughts concerning the execution of Saddam Hussein. Before I share my thoughts on this topic, I need you all to know a few very important facts so you know where I’m coming from. I am a Muslim convert. I’m not a very good one. I’m Suni. My ex husband, and consequently my son are both Shia. I do not believe that I have the right to force my son to follow Suni ways, as both sects believe the child should follow the father’s religion. That doesn’t mean I will discourage him from learning about Suni ways, as I believe with all my heart that I failed to educate myself about the true differences prior to marriage, and thus my son, my ex, and myself will have severe internal conflicts concerning this all in the future. I fully believe that Allah will lead my son to the right path, so long as I make knowledge of both sects available no matter what.

I personally do not believe in the Shia path. But I’m in no position to hold their beliefs against them in any way. I simply can not understand or accept a large number of aspects to it. Though, I can accept that the reasoning for this could be that I’m simply not yet educated enough on the topic itself, or that no one has been able to explain a few things that I believe are contradictory.

I am NOT trying to start a Suni/Shia debate. I am not a scholar and I will probably have little or nothing to add to any conversation of the sorts. I’m simply going to explain my reaction and what I believe is really happening with Saddam’s execution.

I, like countless others watched the video of Saddam’s execution. Don’t bother throwing your shit at me for linking that, as some ignorant, anonymous ass did CG, in the UAE Community Blog. Like it or not, the majority of the population on the planet has some sense of morbid curiosity and will watch this clip for that reason alone. And I’m betting a large percentage of Saddam’s victims’ families need to see this video for some sort of closure, simply because it’s all too common that famous people’s deaths are denied and doubted to the fullest extent. Think about it, how many people still think Elvis is alive? Photoshop can do wonders, as most internet users are well aware. The photographs simply would not be enough for some.

Now back to the topic; my first response to the news of his execution drew a complete blank. I later watched the video and found myself disgusted. Slowly, I started to piece together an actual opinion on it all. You see, I’m not disgusted that Saddam has been executed. I’m not disgusted that he’s been hanged rather than executed through lethal injection or some other ‘humane’ form. I believe in the death sentence. I believe a murderer deserves to die. And there is no doubt, people died in Saddam’s hands. But I also believe that the reason a killer should be executed is because Allah is the best at handing out consequences. And Allah knows best what any person deserves. And execution will send the executed to Allah immediately, and we living can move on knowing that then justice has been truly served.

I was not so disgusted at the shouting of Saddam’s rival’s name. That simply confused me concerning Shia’s a little further. I believe that should I be in the sight of death, the only thing I should be thinking or saying is, “With Allah his soul, where true justice resides”. Don’t misunderstand that, I’ve never been taught that through Islam or elsewhere. I just know it’s what I feel is the morally right thing to think, feel and say in such a situation. I could be way off as my morals certainly aren’t saint-like and I've never watched a person die; however I also believe Allah gave us all the innate ability to know between right and wrong. To me, that was simply wrong. To me, it’s almost like replacing a time when you should be worshiping, with praise for a human being for the sake spite.

Anyway, I wasn’t disgusted at the taunting of a man whose life was seconds from oblivion. That disturbed me, but I can see why some would be unable to bite their tongues.

I was disgusted by the sheer, single laughter heard almost immediately after his demise. To me, that single laughing voice speaks volumes of equality between the evil of Saddam Hussein while slaying countless people and the evil of the man who was able to laugh at such a moment.


Intent; subconscious belief and reasoning. Allah alone knows our intent. Allah alone knows what’s in our hearts. But that sheer laughter, while death has literally just taken place in front of this mans' eye, was an unconscious response. A piece of a man’s heart he simply couldn’t contain. I don't believe he was born with the ability to react in such a way. I believe he was created. Just as I believe Saddam was created.

I don’t know if Saddam ever laughed while or immediately after murdering people. I don’t care to know either. I believe he deserved to be executed. Period. But I do believe that while the Shia’s in Iraq celebrate so joyously for what they consider their victory, and the Suni’s avenge all the loss after both the death of Saddam on the day of Eid, and the loss of the Baath regime, whom they truly loved, they’re all being side-swiped by the kafr, who were responsible for building Saddam into the monster he was in the first place; the kafr who neglected to stop him while the atrocities were actually taking place but forged an excuse to punish him later. I believe that the Muslim’s both Suni & Shia are having their undeniable hate for one another played on; pulled like strings to puppets and neither one is to gain in the long run. I believe that love and love lost and hate, hate for those who where the hands of that loss, two of human beings' strongest emotions are the tools being used by the kafr to tear the Middle East, the Muslims even further apart.

And I believe it’s all for the sake of oil.


Blogger BuJ said...

i asked for opinion and i guess i now got it!

for the first time i saw the video now and i feel quite disgusted.. there is no dignity in it at all.. so many people in iraq use the word "justice" with "saddam's trial" but really there is no justice to taunt him like that before his death and let's be honest.. two wrongs don't make a right.

i agree with tainted, i dunno if saddam laughed after killing people, but it's not relevant..

many seem to think that this will close a bloody chapter in iraq's history.. maybe.. but i believe that the next chapter will be bloodier still.

i believe saddam was killed to be silenced rather than for justice.. so does Robert Fist as well as for many other reasons...

as always, i pray for iraq and the people of iraq.

2:07 AM, January 03, 2007  
Blogger Tainted Female said...

Thank you for the thoughts Buj... I've just edited this AGAIN. LOL! And that link... Who is Robert First? I read the article, but I don't get who he is or how he's privy to the information in all the factual statements he makes.

I believe what he says is true. But I can't seem to find a source or reference to a source for all his facts.

3:49 AM, January 03, 2007  
Blogger BuJ said...

Apologies, the name is Robert Fisk.. it was a typo.. and he's a well-respected journalist who specialises in the middle east. I would recommend googling his name or wiking it for more info. I don't know about his sources, but this guy is the guru!

8:35 AM, January 03, 2007  
Blogger Hot Lemon& Honey said...

Robert Fisk is a very well known journalist and an excellent speaker.

First, about the video, I watched the uncut part, although the image still haunts me, I am glad I did. Whatever was the intention of that man videotaping it on his dirty cell phone, the video it self was a strong reminder for all of us to not to believe the media. The intial verbal report was about Saddam looking frightened and scared...he wasn't, then the intial video that was broadcasted showed what appeared to be two calm men explaing to Saddam the procedure, no voices in the background. There were no reports of him being taunted until the leaked vidoe came out.
He deserved to be executed, he killed many innocent people. but the way it was done is what bothers most of us Muslims. For it to be done on Eid Al Adha at the time when we slauter sheeps, goats for Eid. No muslim would do that, no "democratic wanna be government" should do that, America claimed to have "tried" to stop it yet still handed him over and it was done wrong infront of so many witnesses.
Now the guy with the camera was holding his camera high enough to capture Saddam, so clearly they have seen it. Those officials who were there at the executions are no street men to be calling out names.

You say that the people needed to see evidence that he was actually killed, well if you search the net, there are enough people saying he is Saddams look alike. It is immoral and backwards.

We can always justify behaviour, I can actually defend the guy who laughed after Saddam was hanged and tell he that was a "nervous laughter" which is not uncommon at all. Wrong is Wrong.

The whole thing has alot of meaning to us Muslims. It is a clear message that I feel you havn't read yet. It isn't about the oil Tainted, that's a fraction of what it is.

9:40 AM, January 03, 2007  
Blogger Tainted Female said...

Buj! You didn’t make a typo! I did! LOL! I’ll be sure to look him up. And thank you for the link.

HL&H… I agree with just about everything you say. In fact, I don’t think I wrote anything here that disagrees with it. Actually, I stayed away from the insult of the execution happening on Eid and the morals behind it because it’s already been talked about in the newspapers, the UAE community blog, and the one linking to it (even by you there – yes, I’ve been reading).

You said yourself you can always justify ones behavior. I agree with that too. I can justify that Saddam Hussein committed all the atrocities he did because he was encouraged to do so by the same American Government who built him and Saddam and possibly him believing he was somehow doing good for Iraq (he did claim that till the end), and now the American government claim they tried to stop the execution while simultaneously handing him over. I can justify the laugher of the man as an automatic relief response due to his hate for a man who possibly caused severe torture to his family in the past. I can justify the Shia’s willingness to execute on this day, as an added insult to the man who instilled pure hate in them in the past and a type of revenge towards those who supported him. I can justify America’s actions throughout all of this too. To me, all of these actions are inspired and conceived initially by love & hate, excepting that of the American government, where I believe the initial conception of their actions has simply got to be oil, power and control.


11:17 AM, January 03, 2007  
Blogger CG said...

It was not Eid in Iraq, and the Religious leaders (many of them, both sunni & Shiia) were consulted and all agreed it would be acceptable to execute Saddam before the sunrise on that day.

As for the videotaping on a 'dirty cell phone', I agree it was uncalled for, but had he not done it and leaked it online, then you would be none the wiser regarding the taunting & jeering.

You have a lot of opinions and I am sure you believe them to be correct, but what if, just IF, the owner of that 'dirty cell phone' had suffered directly at the hands of Saddam? We do not know the reasons behind a lot of things that happen, but an open mind and heart will help us to see/understand them.

7:59 PM, January 03, 2007  
Blogger Tainted Female said...

Nice to see you again WesternGuy...

I had a feeling you'd eventually find this entry and have something to say about it. Thanks for sharing the thoughts.

Happy New Year.

1:04 AM, January 04, 2007  
Blogger CG said...

Western guy. You just don't get it, do you? If they had waited one day longer then Saddam would never have been hanged. It was not about power playing and showing everyone who was now in charge. It had to be completed before sunrise on that day or else he would have languished in a cell forever, and believe me, the whole world would have really complained about the taunting then.
HL&H, you said that you watched the uncut part and the image still haunts you. I am curious, as most people have said that it was the sound that was worse to them, as visually there was not really anything to see. After viewing the executions of foreigners by insurgents when it has taken over 30 seconds to slowly saw someones head off with a blunt knife during which we can hear his screams turn to gurgles as the knife hacks its way through the windpipe, then I would say this was quite humane, if ever there could be a humane way to kill someone. As for the jeering, I don't think he was aware of anything. All I object to is Muaffak Al Rubaiee talking live on international tv and saying that it was all very civilized and that Saddam was treated with the utmost respect before, during and after his execution. Which we all now know to be Absolute bull shit and he himself was stood only 2 -3 meters away from the 'dirty cell phone' guy, so what the phone heard, he mut have heard as well.

8:45 AM, January 04, 2007  
Blogger BuJ said...

Western Guy,

Thanks for your comments, as it's always refreshing to have someone disagree for a change.

However I am afraid that you do not see the whole picture and from what you say it seems CNN is your only viewpoint on information regarding Iraq.

Let me tell you this. Iraq was a mess ever since the Brits (unfortunately the US was not a power in those days) cut and carved the world, or rather their empire as it crumbled. Bad planning is manifest also in Kashmir, India, Pakistan, Palestine, and Lebanon compliments of HM's Government.

Iraq has always been instable and bloody in term of governments. Actually Saddam probably gave Iraq it's longest time of relative stability between 1987 and 1991 as no wars were fought then and the country was doing well.

Iraq is not a homogenous country, but a cocktail of Sunni, Shia, Kurds etc as you hopefully know. For one branch to take control, it usually has to use brute force to silence the other two branches. It just happened that Saddam was Sunni and the rest is history.

America made things worse. Iraq is no Kuwait, and Iran is no Iraq. We're talking a country the size of France. Just because you successfully kicked out Saddam from Kuwait in 1991 doesn't mean you will subdue his country while enjoying a 7UP commercial.

To conclude, Iraq was a mess before the Americans rolled their tanks and bombs in. However their occupation is a disaster, as probably all the world (including CNN) will tell you.

This mentions nothing about US aid to Saddam from 1979 to 1987, which obviously we do not discuss, eh?

9:38 AM, January 04, 2007  
Blogger nzm said...

HL&H: This is the second time that I see you comment that it's not all about the oil, and yet not qualify your statement.

Can you enlighten us as to what it's all about?

2:01 PM, January 04, 2007  
Blogger Hot Lemon& Honey said...

Simple nzm, what does Saddam on Osama have in common other than the fact that they are labelled as "terrorists". Who will benefit formt he instability in our region? Who is threatned by those countries that the US are targetting these days?
There is your answer.

5:40 PM, January 04, 2007  
Blogger Hot Lemon& Honey said...

"It was not Eid in Iraq, and the Religious leaders (many of them, both sunni & Shiia) were consulted and all agreed it would be acceptable to execute Saddam before the sunrise on that day." it wasn't eid in Iraq? says who, the fact that Shiaa don't celebrate Eid on the same day Sunni's do doesnt mean that it wasn't Eid in Iraq.
and who were consulted????? if you seriously mean what you wrote CG, i wont even bother making a point.
And for your info, he was executed after sunrise. Read read read before you write such nonnsense

5:44 PM, January 04, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

HL&H, it is pe

ople like yourself who will only be upping the insurgency in Iraq.
When will you see that the majority rules?


8:00 PM, January 04, 2007  
Blogger nzm said...

HL&H: you still talk in riddles, do you have a straight answer? Spell it out for me please, so that I don't enter into a debate over assumptions about what you actually mean, but over something concrete from you to which I can respond with the utmost of my intelligence and knowledge. Thanks!

In general, if the mobile phone video had not been released, we would never have known the truth of the events around Saddam's execution. If you've read Riverbend's (Baghdad Burning) latest post, you'll get to know how inaccurate the reports on CNN and BBC were. Sadly, there will be many people who see, hear and believe the big media companies than there will be people who will watch the cellphone execution video.

I would also recommend reading Neurotic Iraqi Housewife's blog too, to get an idea of what Iraqis are thinking from those that are there.

Western Guy:
**If the US appealed the date of execution, why did they hand Saddam over to the Iraqis in the first place? Surely they must have known that he would have been executed at the first chance.

And why hand him over to be executed for killing 148 people when there were far worse other crimes that he should answer to? Was it because the Dujail killings were the only ones in which there was no assistance from other countries? Is that why this charge was trialled first, knowing that he's receive the death penalty for it and they could get rid of him before he implicated others in the other trials?

***You mention 6 million people voted in the Iraqi elections. How many of those were Sunni in relation to Shia? Want to bet that there were more Shia voting than any other sect?

Democracy cannot work in a country where there is a dominant religion, and that religion is again divided into sects where one sect has majority population.

Democracy can only be successful when there are enough swing voters that will choose to vote either way with their conscience, or because they believe in a candidate, or in the values which a party is representing. This means that there have to be no other dominating factors such as a powerful religion to further divide the voting public, and sway their decisions.

****If it had been as simple as coming in and taking control of Basra for the oil shipments they would have done that for sure.

But it wasn't about the oil supply, it was about controlling the price of the oil.

If there's one thing that the US, Iran and Saudi Arabia have in common, it's that they're controlled by oil cartels. The higher the price of oil, the happier those in control will be.

The oil cartel needed to get rid of Saddam because he was causing oil prices to greatly fluctuate up and down. He would cut production or suddenly boost it, or play the UN with its oil-for-food campaign.

Saddam was controlling the oil prices and not the oil cartels. As well as that, he was selling oil in Euros, not US$, so there was another reason for the US cartels not to like it. They were pissed off!

The first thing that the US did was, through the State Department, launch a disastrous coup d'etat in Venezuela in 2003 in an attempt to gain more monopoly. They struck at the oil supply lines to stop production of oil in Venezuela, and in doing so, alienated themselves from the likes of Chavez and the Venezuelan people.

When that strike failed to get the desired result, the oil cartels pushed the US into getting into Iraq to eliminate Saddam. Who did they get to do the pressuring? Who was closest to Bush Jr? Why, Bush Snr of course, who hadn't done the job properly in the first place!

When there is conflict anywhere in the world, we have to look past the "obvious" that's been thrown at us (WMDs, terrorism control, unstable leaders, cruel regimes), and follow the trail to where the money is.

Nothing is done by governments, companies, organisations, cartels or similar unless there's monetary gain or an advantageous tradeoff. Good deeds for nothing are only performed by individual human beings and philanthropists!

In most cases, the money is linked to oil or arms/weaponry deals with a sprinkling of health companies in African nations using their money to gain access to an uneducated population of guinea pigs on which to test their new medicines.

12:02 AM, January 05, 2007  
Anonymous Anonymous said...


He died before dawn Saturday in Iraq

the day Saddam was hanged shortly before dawn.

The execution took place after 6:10 in the morning outside the Green Zone

Saddam's conviction and execution before sunrise

So I have read and read and read some more. And just for your information HL&H, All of my sunni friends who lost relatives at the hands of Saddam were glad it was all over, wether it was the right or wrong way to do it, wether it was justice or revenge, they are just glad it is over and done with.
And since the majority of muslims in Iraq are Shiia and the ruling party are also Shiia, I think it is a safe bet to say that the majority of muslims were NOT celebrating Eid on that day. If you don't like the fact then that really is tough luck. The sooner you accept it then the sooner you can get over it. And you really do need to get over this if you plan on being a psychiatrist. If you cannot resolve these differences in your own head, how on earth are you planning on understanding what goes on in others heads? You have very dogmatic views which you should seriously address.
Do not for one second try to second guess me. I am very rarely wrong, as I do my homework. But if I am wrong, then I will admit it.
And by the way, in Balushi's blog I did not accuse you of being a racist...I accused you of dissing the Shiia. bad bad bad move. READ before you write such nonsense.

4:56 AM, January 05, 2007  
Blogger Tainted Female said...

And now...

You all see why I didn't counter a single comment initially made by WesternGuy.


I'm incredibly disappointed with your response to nzm, but believe I could say the same in response to you concerning a number of debates we've attempted in the past.

11:49 AM, January 05, 2007  
Blogger nzm said...

And you'll note Western Guy that I didn't once resort to insulting you as you claim Buj did, and yet you have no hesitation in calling me paranoid!

But I won't take it as an insult, it's just that you don't have an intelligent answer in response.

2:58 PM, January 05, 2007  
Blogger Tainted Female said...

My 'core audience' is welcome to browse through the Secret Arabian archives, or even some of my older posts here, but they needn't bother. You've shown this reality here.

Your paranoid belief's send you on American Defense tangents that always stray from the point, no matter what you're commenting on. Your responses are always a combination of confused questions concerning other arab/islamic things and even entirely different countries. I believe in my last debate with you concerning Iraq, you were telling me to research Sudan.

Here... for example, you've failed to see that I agree with capital punishment, and asked me who is at fault for Saudi Arabian executions. This is of course among other things that just seemed to go over your head.

This all stems from your pro-American paranoia as far as I'm concerned. It's also the reason why I decided debating with you was useless and I wouldn't waste anymore time on it.

5:57 PM, January 05, 2007  
Blogger nzm said...

A correction to what I wrote above 12:02am: The Venezuela coup d'etat occured in 2002.

Western Guy: I accept your given second and third apologies, but your first isn't necessary because you don't disappoint me at all - I don't give you permission to make me feel that way.

You don't think that my comments are worth of rebuttal, or you can't find a worthy response to my points? There's a difference!

You see, there are some perfect valid questions that I ask back of you, and yet, when you can't find an answer, you believe me to be, and call me, paranoid.

If I'm paranoid, then I'm in good company, for these are some of the people who I read for my information, as they are people who go to the coalface to research their topics. I also read some of the authors whose work appears here, here, here and here among others.

I always attempt to read articles from all perspectives and all opinions, and base what I choose to believe on what I read, see and hear.

To date, I believe that none of these authors have been arrested for their writings. This is mostly because they back up their findings with facts, and they don't hide behind any political office of power where they are immune from questioning and legal action, and they certainly don't sacrifice friends and colleagues who once thought that they were on the same team, but were discarded in efforts to maintain public favour and divert the attention away from who's really at fault.

If you're going to come to the debate, please come prepared with more than a skin-deep line of attack and a first line of defence, and dispense with the name-calling when you can't reply.

I come into a debate to learn and be educated, but so far there's nothing here that I don't already know, haven't already read or will make me see differently which is a pity, because it negates my personal goals.

12:46 AM, January 06, 2007  
Blogger Tainted Female said...


Please stop sending me emails that are intended to draw me into this debate. Whether in private or not. I've made my position clear to you. I DON'T WANT TO DEBATE WITH YOU. I believe I said this months ago in an email, and I've said it here now before you sent your emails. I don't know what makes you think it's ok for you to draw this line with nzm, while not allowing me to draw the same with you, but in all honesty, it's just hypocritical.

With reference to one of your many comments in those emails, I did not throw you to the wolves. First of all, YOU started this debate. The rest are just asking you questions that you're failing to answer. And none of these people are wolves, (nor are they out to get you). The ones that are countering you are well educated, better read people than I am. You'd reach further, learn more and achieve higher through conversing with them than you would wasting time sending your opinions in private to me.

8:49 AM, January 06, 2007  

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